Town
of Ballston Carpenter’s Acres
Sewer Sub-Committee Monthly Meeting
Notes taken
by a town resident on October 2, 2018
Committee members in attendance were; James Callahan, Wes DeVoe, Valerie Dussault, William Goslin, Drew Hamelink, Ed Hernandez, Kim Kotkoskie, Jason Portier, Pat Westbrook, Warren (Kevin) Wheeler, and Steven Yeager.
Other guests & observers were; Ruth Osterlitz, Norm Schulthieiss, and Carl Thurnau
This was the first meeting of the new sewer sub-committee. Each person in the room introduced themselves and then town board member, William Goslin started the meeting.
Wm Goslin - We have had a standing sewer committee for many years and their primary responsibility was the Ballston Lake Project and a lot them helped out with the Route 50 Project and the feeling with that committee is that many of the people are weary of working on other sewer projects and a lot of those committee members will not be part of the Carpenter’s Acres Project going forward just because of the commitment and timing. This group here, I call it a sub-committee, is not an official town committee so anyone can speak or not speak. The real purpose of this gathering to review the Map, Plan and Report. The idea of having it reviewed by residents of Carpenter’s Acres who are interested, and thank you for sharing your time with us, and reason for doing this in this fashion is so we can look at it and see if there is anything inaccurate, if we should change anything, if any parcels should be in or not be in or any other changes. This is not a meeting, I will say now, to voice your opinion for or against. The town has already authorized the preparation of a Map, Plan and Report and once this is complete it will go to the town board and they will determine what to do with it. Our sole purpose here is to look at the report, understand the report, and to point out any errors before it goes to the Town Board. When the Town Board gets it they can do whatever they chose with it but it will have been reviewed by members of this group. I want to explain that this is an informal committee and an informal review. You are welcome to share this with any of your neighbors or friends.
Kim K. - That is one of my functions, if you have a concern I consolidate comments and make suggested edits to Ed and Ed would say yah or nay as to why and if there is an engineering reason that something has to be a certain way or not and we would discuss it as a group before we give it to the board. It is in a draft form right now and there have been a misperception that we may be further along in the process of creating something, but we are not really creating anything, we are just reviewing his engineering report right now. The board has not seen this and does not have an opinion because we did not have you guys as a committee yet to form an opinion or a recommendation to the board.
Wm Goslin - Three years ago we (the town board) got a petition from a group of people in Carpenters’ Acres and it was presented to the board and board did a feasibility study which is basically the predecessor to the Map, Plan and Report. The feasibility study basically took a look at the project and was a high-level view of what it might cost and that was presented to the board. The board subsequently went ahead and ordered a Map, Plan and Report. The Map, Plan and Report is used should the board decide to form a new sewer district. We are progressing along to look at everything associated with this proposed project to the board to consider. That is where we are at.
There are lots of ways the board can decide. There are different ways the board can act.
All committee members were given a copy of the Draft Map, Plan and Report.
Ed H. went over the general outline and content of the report and what was required to be in the report. Ed explained what an EDU is and the annual cost of the debt loan to each resident plus the additional usage costs per home and the hook up costs. There was an audible negative reaction to the cost of the project. Total project cost is 3.9 million dollars. This project is roughly 50% higher than the average cost of sewers in the State. Many asked if there could be grants to help lower the cost. Many also noted that not all the property owner information was correct and up to date in the report.
Ed H. - The state will only give grants to shovel ready projects so until this project is approved they will not even consider any grant applications. There are a lot of things that go into qualifying for a grant.
Jason Portier - Are there any way or something we could do as a committee to increase the odds of getting a grant?
Ed H. explained that there are a lot of things that go into qualifying for a grant. Suggestions on how to get grants including writing letters to local state officials were made.
Wm Goslin – The Town of Ballston has an excellent working relationship with the Environmental Facilities Corporation and I think that is in our favor. We know people there, we have a relationship that has worked out very well. We did receive a major grant for the Ballston Lake Sewer Project but that has an impaired waterbody. There are a number opportunities to apply for grants for different things. For example, the money we got was from the Federal Government through the State of New York but there are different programs, Cuomo could say they are going to help with an infrastructure build, etc so there are various times when this comes up and we are to keep our ears to listen to what opportunities come up. “You got to have a line in the water with bait on it before you can catch anything”.
Wm Goslin – We will not discuss the cost here or whether you are in favor of sewers. Your job as a committee is to look over the Map Plan and Report and come back with any errors found or concerns. Maybe you do not like were the pipe is located or maybe it does not go past some residences or anything like that. All we need to say to the board is that there was a group of residents that looked at the Map, Plan and Report and reviewed it for accuracy. We do not want to know what they think of the cost or if they want sewers or not.
Kim K. - We will give you some time to read this and meet in a month. The next meeting will be the first Monday of the month on November 5 at 6:00pm.
Any questions can be emailed to Kim K.
Adjourned. Open discussion to follow.
Highlights from open discussion:
Pat Westbrook - I was for the study but after seeing the costs I am concerned they are too high and I am interested in seeing if grants would help.
Valerie Dussault - it is a lot of money
James Callahan – the way these costs are now here on this report, at least based on the discussion I have had on my street this is not affordable.
Steve Yeager – everyone has a choice right? So, on that some people have a choice whether they want it or don’t want it. I do not have a choice. I do not have another 40k to put in another septic system to replace the one I installed in 2001. Everyone has a choice, I don’t
James Callahan - Those houses should not have been built
Steve Yeager – that’s on the town, not going to help me.
Wm Goslin - Ed where is the watershed in reference to this?
Ed H. - It is not in it.
Kevin Wheeler – If sewers were only $250 a month.. is anybody opposed to sewers for anything except cost?
Valerie Dussault – I do not have anything wrong with my septic, it is the cost.
Jason Portier – I agree the cost is high, but for me I am willing to pay for it because it will add to the value of my house and make it more desirable. I willing to put my own time in if that is possible to get grant money.
James Callahan – It may increase the value of your property but when you go to sell your property the taxes will be much higher and hurts marketability.
Ed H - So the big hurdle here is that is it a sewer project and the costs to the residents are a lot and the town honestly probably does not have the stomach to go through another like Route 50 so there really needs to be a lot of support for this in the neighborhood. So you as members of that neighborhood can review this, make sure it is accurate and what you want to present then it will be going around and discussing it with your neighbors and there is going to need be a lot of support.
James Callahan – The most importantly thing is to do this in a democratic way.
Wm Goslin - The board has a number of choices OK. 1.) they could not take any action at all and say it is too expensive. 2.) They could call for a referendum 3.) They could pass a submissive referendum, you could pass a petition among residents and that could force the board to install the system. 4.) The board could act on the resident’s behalf and just install the system.
Wm Goslin – The boards purpose here is to act on the resident’s behalf to look at this project objectively. We have not pushed sewers unless they were requested of the town board. We have no horse in the game.
Ruth Osterlitz – I would like to disagree with Wm Goslin to the fact that the Town has promoted sewers and hired a PR firm to help people write letters to the editor pro-sewer and design pro-sewer lawn signs. And the tax payers paid for that. So you can not tell us that you do not push sewers.
Wm Goslin – that is totally incorrect, the PR firm that was hired was hired on an annual basis and what they were hired for is to do things like the town newsletter and they were also helping get the word out when a lot of misinformation is out there like there is on this project OK so that PR relations firm was not hired when we started Route 50 and they were not fired when we completed Route 50.
Ed H. – It was the business association that paid for those signs.
Ruth O. – OK so the PR firm was already working for the town. The invoices from the PR firm says that they worked with Al Pirigyi on his letter to the editor and they worked with 3 others and they also helped design the pro-sewer signs and the tax payers paid for that. The Town of Ballston or the town board did promote sewers. I find the comment that you made false.
Wm Goslin – OK That’s great. I disagree.
Valerie Dussault – So what’s the truth?
Wm Goslin – The truth is the town hired a PR firm on an annual basis in January 2018 for the year to represent the town and to help communicate to the residents. One of the things they are doing is the monthly newsletter that we have done. There were communication projects associated with the sewer mainly because it was a big deal in town and they did help us with that. I can tell you that they….. lets just leave it at that. This coming year in January we will vote to renew their contract or not renew their contract. Basically the board has found they we did not do a good job communicating with the residents.
Valerie Dussault – so basically there are other towns that do not have to hire a PR firm?
Wm Goslin – Well everybody does it differently depending upon the size of the town. We are growing, and we didn’t feel we were communicating and actually thought by hiring a public relations firm we could learn how to communicate better. The public relations firm is a tool we give the Supervisor to help him communicate with the residents. They communicate on a lot of different subjects. If you look at the email that was just sent out it mentions a lot of things.
Kevin Wheeler – There are pipes buried in the ground for storm water. Can we use them to save money?
Ed H. – It is against the law.
Kevin Wheeler – I do not understand why they don’t want us to combine them.
Steve Yeager - Whenever you drive around my neighborhood after a big rain you smell septics.
Ed H. – One thing you could look at is tests and if the numbers are high – that could effect grant money points. We were not hired to do this, if you are aware of a known environmental issue you could run some tests yourself. I could put in this report that residents have complained of septic smell. Those are the kind of notes you want to put in there to strengthen the report and facts.
Wm. Goslin – I would strongly suggest that if you have stories like that to put them in the report.
Ed H. – Those tests run only about $35. There is a place in Ballston Spa to get the bottles.
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